It’s time to correct the Pimax “8K” name issue


#123

If you recall no different to how small a 20" Widescreen looks compared to a 20" Pan & scan (4:3).

720p is considered HD.
1080i slightly better
1080p FHD

I still remember the old res standards
Monochrome
Cga
Ega
Vga
Svga
Xga

All 4:3

Add a W before svga & xga
16:9 & 16:10 ratios

Now (16:9)
HD
FHD
QHD
4k UHD
8k UHD (QUHD?)

If you notice no uhd in pimax. Its curious that they never disclaim the 5k for not being 5k as would also require 4 screens to be at a tv aspect ratio. :beers::joy::+1::sparkles:

You always get the “full” resolution at a given aspect ratio.

Going by the wiki 1:1 is full 8k as its 8k8k instead of 16:9 8k4k


#124

“HD Ready” did not differentiate 720 from 1080. It meant the the TV had no HD tuner. You had to have a cable or satellite box that output HD to use it. 720 was considered HD and where it sacrificed resolution it gained in having faster progressive scanning instead of interlaced. I bought a 720 knowing full well the difference, as I’m sure all serious 8k customers do and will. I bought that thing back in 2005 (paying $2500!) and had to subscribe to the short lived VOOM service in order to see any HD content which was all crappy fluff content!


#125

No. “In the most basic terms, HD Ready TVs and set top boxes can show you 720p images at 1280×720 pixels. Full HD TVs and set top boxes show 1080p images at 1920×1080 pixels.”


#126

I don’t want to get into one of those technical sparring matches so this is my last post on this. I think that the writer was still in elementary school when HD was introduced. I was in the market. Much of what he says doesn’t jibe with my research and consumer questions in the early days of HD. It may be that some of the jargon has evolved in the 13-14 years since HD was introduced. He says toward the bottom “Ignore “1080i” or anything with an “i” after it. Interlaced video doesn’t look good and doesn’t matter.” Back when HD was introduced all the 1080 TVs were “i”. (At least in the US)

But to the point of my rebuttal of your original post… I don’t think the TV industry was trying to pull a trick on the consumers. And I don’t think Pimax is either. But your certainly entitled to your opinion. :slight_smile:


#127

I guess that in case of Pimax 8K it is even worse. Since they claim 8K (albeit with half of the pixel of what 8K normally means) and shows on it only 2560*1440 content.

Kind of like selling 1920*1080 TV display with WQHD badge and showing only 720p upscaled content on it. In short it is a mess. But I do not really care much anymore as I understand that Chinese do marketing differently and also Pimax are grown-ups so they know what they are doing. If not God help us :slight_smile:


#128

this is reassuring.XD


#129

I’d have to agree with the notion that the upscaling is somewhat misleading. But everyone knows why it has to be done. And there is an advertised model made specifically to not upscale so there’s no intent to deceive. Maybe that’s why the upscaling hasn’t caused the brouhaha that the 8k pixel “count” has. Any buyer just needs to read the specs on what he/she is buying. If they don’t, shame on them. If they do then they’ll probably buy the thing anyway for all the real improvements it offers over gen 1 HMDs. That is, assuming Pimax can satisfactorily fix all the bugs. I say “satisfactorily” because I don’t expect it to be perfect.

EDIT: It’s worth noting (according to Wiki) that in the US, ABC, ESPN and Fox broadcast in 720p which gets upscaled to 1080 if you have a 1080 TV. And I’ll bet >90% of viewers have never noticed a difference. And if I’m not mistaken, the 1080 channels transmit in 1080i. (Which maybe gets combined into a progressive scan?)


#130

Indeed thats why its not 8k uhd; its just 8k. Same with the 5k which is never given the its not really 5k as it only has half of 5k at 16:9.

One aeticle suggests that 8k uhd is not the next big thing; that 21:9 will be.


#131

"Let’s introduce 720p and 1080p and call the first one “HD ready” with HD in big font and “ready” as small as possible. I remember buying such “HD TV” myself, also probably 13 years ago, thinking it was actually 1080p when I found out it could only do 720p/1080i. I know others fell for it too. I bought my Pimax 4k thinking it could do native 4k and I wasn’t exactly alone, just read the forums (same with that HD TV). If you think the manufacturers didn’t intend for that to happen, then I call that extremely naive. Of course, the ‘mistake’ is made by the consumer and if he had done more research, he wouldn’t have made it. Yet, that’s what manufacturers cash in on. I know for a FACT that there will be people who are going to buy the 8k who think it’s really 8k resolution. Pimax knows that too and journalists know that too, that’s why every magazine out there warns their readers and start with a disclaimer telling them it’s NOT really 8k. At least their readers won’t fall for it. The result though is that a lot of people will think it’s deceptive marketing, which won’t look good at all.


#132

I had s 1080p hd ready tv (no hd tuner)

Now the real misnomer was displays/projectors that could accept 1080p signals but in small print the native res was no where near 1920*1080.

One such projector’s native res was 640*480


#133

I’m really not sure why you insist on “hd ready” ‘just means’ not having a tuner. Just google it, it says EVERYWHERE it’s 720p, not 1080p (though it can do 1080i). https://www.google.com/search?q=hd+ready+tv+means&oq=“hd+ready”+tv+&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0l5.3672j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 although some sites also talk about the tuner.

Fact is: hd ready does NOT have 1080p.


#134

Well like one said they changed meanings over time.

Before Widescreen became standard. Many old 4:3 rear projection 50" TVs were HD & HD ready which at the time meant tuner.

Your link has 2 requirements. 720hd &/or no hd tuner. A TV without an hd tuner is only ready as it requires an external input to display hd.

720 is HD
1080 is fhd

And

https://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=303728

Now later i do beleive they redefined 4:3 hd to edtv


#135

Now tell me in all seriousness that that’s NOT confusing. “Yes sir, your TV is HD, but it’s not FULL HD so it’s not 1080p”.
“Yes you bought a liter of coke but sorry it’s not a FULL liter so the bottle is only half full”

Well you’ll probably insist it’s not confusing at all, since you insist that 8k isn’t deceptive either :slight_smile:


#136

The only confusion is understanding manufacturer’s advertising gimmick spec methods.

720p is the so to speak beginnings of HD spec (sort of or at least once redefined as hd refering to 16:9) & is 1k which folks often mistakenly think 1080p is.

Again we like naming schemes.

As you know with computers prior we describe displays on the pc side with “?GA” which represented Res & number of colors (primarily) put a “W” in front of the “?GA” & now you have widescreen.

So HD now represents tv standard of 16:9
720p HD (1280720) 1K (True)
1080p FHD (1980
1080) 2K (Less)
1440p QHD (25601440) 2.5K (True)
2160p UHD (3840
2160) 4K (Less)
4320p UHD (7680*4320) 8K (Considerably Less)

With using the HD naming scheme as accepted today the above is true for “k” hd displays.

True K display would be 1:1 others are less.

So similarily a new standard of letters could be introduced for a special purpose displays.

Oculus/Vive 2.1k1.2k. (FHDVR)
PiMax BE. 2.5k
1.4k. (QHDVR)
PiMax 4k. 3.8k2.1k (4kHDVR)
PiMax 5k. 5.3k
1.4k (5kUWVR)
PiMax 8k. 7.6k*2.1k (8kUWVR)

Edit Alternatively

We have some standardization in VR

2kSFVR

k= Width in pixels rounded up…

_x_F = Fov (x is S/W/U)
-S = Standard 90 to 110
-W = Wide >110 to 160
-U = Ultra Wide >160 to 200

_y_R= Reality (y is A/M/V)
-A = Augmented
-M = Mixed (MS)
-V = Virtual

We now have a marketable basic spec standard.


#137

Which they purposely made confusing because it’s easier to sell something when people think it can do more than it actually can. To market a product with capability X and another product that can do more as 'FULL X" that’s just misleading marketing. Same with Pimax 8k. But oh well you’ll never admit to it, your pimax love clouds your vision, I’ve been noting that for quite a while.


#138

Again isn’t funny no complaint on calling the 5k “5k” even though on the same HD thought applied against the 8k it only has half the res.

We all know that the K standard represents res & has in reality nothing to do with height.

Same with the ####p scale only focuses on the height & is often expressed as #p @ y:x

TV scale simply uses 2 to 3 letters to represent Resolutions at 16:9 with. “?HD” being its quick reference after setting HD is minimally 720p@16:9

So 8k HD is 16:9

And BTW it waa you who said mfgrs are not in tge habit of educating ppl on specs.

As I said & is an absolute truth true 8k would be 1:1

Your mixing standards. With resolution only direct reporting is accurate instead of using “#k” (width) or #p which focuses on height or “?hd” (TV broadcast format) Which focuses on specific resolutions in a 16:9 format, or “?ga/w?ga” PC standard representing certain res.


#139

Obviously the 5k is the same deceptive name giving.

No, we do not all know that. Just google it:
https://www.google.com/search?q=8k+resolution&oq=8k+resolution&aqs=chrome..69i57j69i60l3j0l2.2118j0j9&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

First answer google gives: “8K refers to the horizontal resolution of 7,680 pixels, forming the total image dimensions of (7680×4320), otherwise known as 4320p.”

Of course I understand your point, technically you’re right that 8k is also 7680 * 2 pixels. But still, it’s not what the public expects when they hear 8k resolution. Pimax knows that.


#140

All of these are 8k resolution not to be confused with 8k HD aka 8k UHD as only 1 matches.

What the public presumes & what is true iften is not in alignment.

Now its not like measure “Gallon” as in Gallon of Gas.

Can you tell me how much is in 1 Gallon?

Truth is no. Since we have 2 different Gallons

Imp Gallon is not the same as US Gallon


#141

Nobody cares about a few pixels more or less. People do care when you’re talking about 50% less. That 8192 vs 7680 discussion is really besides the point here, nobody cares.


#142

Losing over .5k is alot. Proper 8k at 16:8 works out to

8000*4500 if mem serves.

Though that assumes your going by k=1000 & not the other standard that k=1024

Double the current 8k uhd & call it 16k uhd is completely wrong 153608680 with over 1k loss in res (160009000)

That’s why imho its wrong to use the K standard at all as its being used represent bumped up numbers instead of min.